I'm wondering how people who find a soaked logbook can tell that the pigment inks run, and the dye inks don't. Do you know your fellow letterboxers so well that you know what brands of ink your peers are using?
As an artist, I think that the distinctions between the two types of ink may be more about "branding" the product than about describing the actually properties of the ink. After all, a dye is supposed to change the color of the material it is applied to (think: your red t shirt) and pigment is not (think: getting housepaint on your red t shirt.) Artists acrylics, to use one example, use both pigments and dyes in their products. I believe that pigments are more color fast, and dyes are more fugative, but that generally refers to light fastness, which is not a big issue inside of a closed book!
I think it would be interested to look at the Material Safety Data Sheet, and see it the colorants in these two types of ink actually are pigments in the the "pigment" products and dye in the "dye" products.
But I'm on vacation in Hawaii, and can't be bothered to look up MSDSes righht now....
Lisascenic
please please please do not read any hostility in my question......
a dumb question
3 messages in this thread |
Started on 2005-11-18
a dumb question
From: Lisa and Robb (lazar.bauer@earthlink.net) |
Date: 2005-11-18 07:58:22 UTC-10:00
Re: a dumb question
From: StarSaels (steves_1701@yahoo.com) |
Date: 2005-11-18 19:08:20 UTC
Good question... no hostility read in that (I could see the grin on your face).
I've seen logbooks that have been soaked, soaked, soaked and most of the stamp
impressions remained on the pages. Even as an artist myself, the only way I can tell that
someone used a pigment was because it leached through the page and affixed itself to the
page underneath (as well as the one on top).
I'd wager that it's the stamp impressions made with washable markers that disappeared.
Cha-ching... another 2 cents.
SteveS
--- In letterbox-usa@yahoogroups.com, Lisa and Robb wrote:
>
> I'm wondering how people who find a soaked logbook can tell that the pigment inks run,
and the dye inks don't. Do you know your fellow letterboxers so well that you know what
brands of ink your peers are using?
>
> As an artist, I think that the distinctions between the two types of ink may be more
about "branding" the product than about describing the actually properties of the ink.
After all, a dye is supposed to change the color of the material it is applied to (think: your
red t shirt) and pigment is not (think: getting housepaint on your red t shirt.) Artists
acrylics, to use one example, use both pigments and dyes in their products. I believe that
pigments are more color fast, and dyes are more fugative, but that generally refers to light
fastness, which is not a big issue inside of a closed book!
>
> I think it would be interested to look at the Material Safety Data Sheet, and see it the
colorants in these two types of ink actually are pigments in the the "pigment" products and
dye in the "dye" products.
>
> But I'm on vacation in Hawaii, and can't be bothered to look up MSDSes righht now....
>
> Lisascenic
>
> please please please do not read any hostility in my question......
>
I've seen logbooks that have been soaked, soaked, soaked and most of the stamp
impressions remained on the pages. Even as an artist myself, the only way I can tell that
someone used a pigment was because it leached through the page and affixed itself to the
page underneath (as well as the one on top).
I'd wager that it's the stamp impressions made with washable markers that disappeared.
Cha-ching... another 2 cents.
SteveS
--- In letterbox-usa@yahoogroups.com, Lisa and Robb
>
> I'm wondering how people who find a soaked logbook can tell that the pigment inks run,
and the dye inks don't. Do you know your fellow letterboxers so well that you know what
brands of ink your peers are using?
>
> As an artist, I think that the distinctions between the two types of ink may be more
about "branding" the product than about describing the actually properties of the ink.
After all, a dye is supposed to change the color of the material it is applied to (think: your
red t shirt) and pigment is not (think: getting housepaint on your red t shirt.) Artists
acrylics, to use one example, use both pigments and dyes in their products. I believe that
pigments are more color fast, and dyes are more fugative, but that generally refers to light
fastness, which is not a big issue inside of a closed book!
>
> I think it would be interested to look at the Material Safety Data Sheet, and see it the
colorants in these two types of ink actually are pigments in the the "pigment" products and
dye in the "dye" products.
>
> But I'm on vacation in Hawaii, and can't be bothered to look up MSDSes righht now....
>
> Lisascenic
>
> please please please do not read any hostility in my question......
>
Re: a dumb question
From: Amy (amymisha@comcast.net) |
Date: 2005-11-18 19:10:58 UTC
Actually it's the other way around....dye inks run and bleed away,
pigments remain.
I know this from personal expirience, after rescuing at least 2 water
logged books. I always stamp in pigment ink, and my sign is always
fine....you can tell which pages anyone stamped in dye inks on,
because their signatures are gone. Also, I was rubberstamping for
many years before I started letterboxing. When doing background
techniques with a dye ink pad you can spritz water on it for a spotty
effect, etc. You can't do that with pigment ink pads.
I think the emulsions in most pigment ink pads are what keep the
images more water-fast (or whatever the word would be). Those inks
seem thikcer than dye inks, which are water based.
here's a decent link:
http://www.peripower.com/inkinfo.html
HTH,
amymisha
--- In letterbox-usa@yahoogroups.com, Lisa and Robb
wrote:
>
> I'm wondering how people who find a soaked logbook can tell that
the pigment inks run, and the dye inks don't. Do you know your
fellow letterboxers so well that you know what brands of ink your
peers are using?
>
> As an artist, I think that the distinctions between the two types
of ink may be more about "branding" the product than about describing
the actually properties of the ink. After all, a dye is supposed to
change the color of the material it is applied to (think: your red t
shirt) and pigment is not (think: getting housepaint on your red t
shirt.) Artists acrylics, to use one example, use both pigments and
dyes in their products. I believe that pigments are more color fast,
and dyes are more fugative, but that generally refers to light
fastness, which is not a big issue inside of a closed book!
>
> I think it would be interested to look at the Material Safety Data
Sheet, and see it the colorants in these two types of ink actually
are pigments in the the "pigment" products and dye in the "dye"
products.
>
> But I'm on vacation in Hawaii, and can't be bothered to look up
MSDSes righht now....
>
> Lisascenic
>
> please please please do not read any hostility in my question......
>
pigments remain.
I know this from personal expirience, after rescuing at least 2 water
logged books. I always stamp in pigment ink, and my sign is always
fine....you can tell which pages anyone stamped in dye inks on,
because their signatures are gone. Also, I was rubberstamping for
many years before I started letterboxing. When doing background
techniques with a dye ink pad you can spritz water on it for a spotty
effect, etc. You can't do that with pigment ink pads.
I think the emulsions in most pigment ink pads are what keep the
images more water-fast (or whatever the word would be). Those inks
seem thikcer than dye inks, which are water based.
here's a decent link:
http://www.peripower.com/inkinfo.html
HTH,
amymisha
--- In letterbox-usa@yahoogroups.com, Lisa and Robb
>
> I'm wondering how people who find a soaked logbook can tell that
the pigment inks run, and the dye inks don't. Do you know your
fellow letterboxers so well that you know what brands of ink your
peers are using?
>
> As an artist, I think that the distinctions between the two types
of ink may be more about "branding" the product than about describing
the actually properties of the ink. After all, a dye is supposed to
change the color of the material it is applied to (think: your red t
shirt) and pigment is not (think: getting housepaint on your red t
shirt.) Artists acrylics, to use one example, use both pigments and
dyes in their products. I believe that pigments are more color fast,
and dyes are more fugative, but that generally refers to light
fastness, which is not a big issue inside of a closed book!
>
> I think it would be interested to look at the Material Safety Data
Sheet, and see it the colorants in these two types of ink actually
are pigments in the the "pigment" products and dye in the "dye"
products.
>
> But I'm on vacation in Hawaii, and can't be bothered to look up
MSDSes righht now....
>
> Lisascenic
>
> please please please do not read any hostility in my question......
>